NBA Live 10 Demo Available, Post Impressions Here (360)

[johnrice20022002]

Haven't read through the entire thread, but I'll just say this. If you want to exploit mismatches in a basketball game, this is the game to do it. More specifically, Taller guys v. smaller guys in terms of height. Lamar Odom against any Magic small forward is a serious advantage for the Lakers squad. And because he has some serious handles, nobody can stop him from driving to the rack. I beg yall to sub him in for Artest and see how unfair it is. I pray for Michael Pietrus each time he's covering L.O. on an Iso...just plain nasty!

[Behindshadows]

Quote: Originally Posted by Playmakers

Agree if you haven't played it over the last 3-4 years then yes it's a huge jump in a one year period. But if you observed flaws from a period of 4 years and they still exist today then you just can't ignore it because it's something that has always been there that hinders game play. I break it down in two ways a new guy is going say wow this game is 1 year away from being GREAT if only they touch up on this or correct that next year for NBA Live 11 A old head head is going to say damn why is this still in the game after 4 years and why hasn't this been corrected after 4 years. Rocket dunking is going to be something a new guy can tolerate because he assumes it's a one time thing. Poor AI tendencies during basic basketball situations won't frustrate the new guy as much because he'll assume it's a one time thing. 4th or 5th options taking over on offense won't frustrate a new guy as much because again he'll assume it's a one time thing. But if you've rented or played any of the previous versions over the last 3-4 years you'll see FLAWS dating as far back as Live 07 in NBA Live 10 DEMO. I used the DEMO because that's all we can judge it off of right now. The actual Final Version could very well be a totally different game but that's the Final Version. I can only comment on what I see right now in the DEMO version and I think most of the guys that are complaining or upset with something also realize it's just the DEMO version but i've seen quiet a few of them mention like i have that it's starting to get repetive (The same Flaws). Yes they have drastically improved from where they came from......but there has to be away to get some of the crap we see year in and year out FINALLY TAKEN OUT OF THE GAME COMPLETELY. When I see guys that are hardcore NBA 2K fans complain about something that has been in 2K for years I understand them now because it's the same with NBA Live. Our complaints are more about things that shouldn't be around anymore after 3-4 years. Yes we appreciate all the good things that are in the game. The bad things should be judged the same way if not more because they have been CONSISTENTLY in the game for years.

Playmakers we cool as hell and I'm glad you back on OS, I even protested when you were gone, looking up old post to find out you should have never left.

But now that your back, do me a favor! Stop being so critical on a Demo, something that was created months ago, before the guys could even really put their foot into Live 10. They know this demo is flawed as all demo's are! lol

You be punishing these guys, like they are the same devs who made those other 3 hideous games.

[HMcCoy]

Funny how Live is never "hideous" until right before the new one drops, lol.

Over the last 3 seasons, Playmakers has put in more work for the Live community than any non-dev on this site. Please show the man some respect.

[Behindshadows]

Quote: Originally Posted by HMcCoy

Funny how Live is never "hideous" until right before the new one drops, lol. Over the last 3 seasons, Playmakers has put in more work for the Live community than any non-dev on this site. Please show the man some respect.

lol

As I do agree, he even made Live 08 playable, and that took a lot of edits. But it still doesn't dismiss that this game is no where near as bad as the previous ones, nor is it even in the same leagues. To see this much change in under a year is incredible. Especially having to clean up older developers messes. These guys should be getting butchered for their work, but instead appreciated.

Now I will say one thing, Playmakers insights on what can be better can come after the full version is released, not what a demo is doing wrong. Because Playmakers knows and I mean really knows the Live franchise and has done amazing work in the praise. I was just saying not to criticize a demo so hard. His insight on the full version is a different story.

And it was no disrespect, it was just spoke truth!!!

[loadleft]

More things I've noticed:

For all the guys that say there's too many steals, I've found that you actually can cheese the freestyle right into the paint quite easily with no steals at all. Scoring once there is another story. I've found the excessive steals come in when most of your moves are side to side moves like cross-overs and spin moves, anything that extends the ball out to the sides of your body. Conversely, I've found I can walk right into the paint with front to back crossovers (from left to right or vice-verse through the legs but ball ends up behind you) or behind the back dribbles, for the most part any find of dribble that you'd use IRL to "keep the ball away" from the defenders. It's quite easy, I even did it back to back to back for several possessions just to confirm it's possible. I shook Gasol to death doing these moves with Lewis he kept biting on the step backs and I was able to hit him w/a quick cross and get to the hoop at will. I know it's not "sim" and I wouldn't make it a habit of doing that but I was just trying to figure out what I could get away with in the game. In a nutshell where people use to abuse the left to right stick movement now it's up and down. I could even freestyle with VC in front of Kobe and Artest, which is something I intially couldn't do. So that's a negative for some and positive for others all in all it amounts to you have to keep the ball away from the defender in my book just like IRL.

Live, as it always has, relies on button timing. All those that find defense tough and are being scored on even with good D, need to adjust your button timing. I'd say that button timing is so important that it can be abused. Several times I've played poor defense but since I knew when, in relation to the offensive player release of the ball, and to press the button and where to be I was still able to cause the CPU to miss. Again this can be viewed as negative or positive. I happen to know this was the case in both games last year as I tested it. I could stand 10 virtual feet away from my man and make him miss every time in Live 09, NBA 2K9, and Live 10 Demo although in Demo 10 ft may be an exaggeration as I noticed that where you are is a little more critical than in the other 2. The timing thing is also the case with lay-ups and dunks.

Like Playmakers, I am a long time Live guy (I've owned everyone of them) and I do see some of the same problems from past Lives. One of the ones that stand out the most to me is that PG's seems to be more aggressive and will take over at times, but this seems to be the case only when faced with inferior defense. IRL there's probably never a time when D-Fish will just attack off the bounce the whole game, but if I play poor D on him and let him get a 2-3 shot head of steam he'll turn into MJ on me and Kobe will just watch. I also noticed that if I play him tight though or switch a bigger defender on him he'll crawl into a hole and hide. I guess that's realistic but it just looks odd so I am not sure what to think about that. IRL if I got a guy that I know I can kill then I am going to kill him vs. I can't even cross half court without my defender taking the ball from me then I'll pass it ever time I touch it.

These are the newest observations I've had in the game, I still love Live 10 but I just thought since I've had mostly positive things to say I should report anything that stood out to me that wasn't necessarily positive.

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Wow, if this Playmakers guy really made 08 playable, then ALL RESPECT SIR, and go right ahead and keep providing your critiques. They can only help these guys make the game better.

I remember spending SO MUCH time in the Live 08 sliders, just to get it some semblance of playability, me and my boy in the dorm. Sadly, we never succeeded (the excellent NBA 2K8 being available had something to do with this, I just don't know how anyone was able to stick out a whole season of Live 07 or 08).

To me, this is the first playable Live on next gen, because personally (I stress "personally"), Live 09 mighta been solid, but the fact that made shots always had one trajectory, combined with the fact you couldn't time your own release, were gamebreakers for me, among the other flaws like animations and such.

I feel guys like PM tho, because it's cool to recognize how good a game is, and we all know that this Live is the best Live in a LONG time. But as hardcore bball gamers/players, we study these games, we dissect them, we been playing since well before Live 95 even, so these devs won't be off the hook until their game is perfect.

Which means they'll never be off the hook.

[Playmakers]

Quote: Originally Posted by Behindshadows

Playmakers we cool as hell and I'm glad you back on OS, I even protested when you were gone, looking up old post to find out you should have never left. But now that your back, do me a favor! Stop being so critical on a Demo, something that was created months ago, before the guys could even really put their foot into Live 10. They know this demo is flawed as all demo's are! lol You be punishing these guys, like they are the same devs who made those other 3 hideous games.

Ha-Ha

I don't how old the demo is 2 months, 4 months or maybe even 6 months old.....

If it is that old maybe they should have just waited for a more established demo to present to their FAN BASE.

It's no different from the Madden Demo people are going to have their opinions DEMO OR NOT

Maybe I shouldn't point out the basic flaws in the demo and maybe I could just assume that those flaws won't exist in the Final Version.

But wouldn't it be pretty bad if they released the Final Version and didn't reliaze half those flaws existed because NO ONE wanted to point out anything bad about the demo?

Heck they didn't even know that the PG holds the ball at times until someone pointed it out to them......

I think that's the problem now days way too many guys have to be careful about what they say regarding a game now days because if your too positive/critical about something you could fall out of favor real quick with the MASSSES.

At times I get the feeling that some people actually do get their feelings hurt if you don't say something 100% positive now days about 2K or NBA Live. So you get guys walking around on egg shells not wanting to really speak their mind anymore about either game.

I think if guys are being respectful and not disrespecting anyone they shoudn't be held hostage about how they feel in regards to this game or any other sports game.

I'm here to discuss sports video games just like I would discuss a real life sports game in a barber shop.

When you go to a barber shop and a group of guys are waiting for a haircut you are going to hear good things about a team or player and your going to hear bad things about team or player.

These Sports Games are no different..........I'm pretty sure the developers realize they must have tough skin now days because one guy is going to praise their product and another guy is going to feel different about their product.

It may not be fair but I'm sure there are a lot of guys who are using this demo as a way to decide if they should spend their $60 bucks or not.

If people are sensitive over the games then maybe they should avoid message boards all together because you have sports forums to discuss sports/games and along the way your going to hear the both good and bad of a game no matter if it's 50% complete or 100%complete.

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Loadleft is absolutely right. He put it in perfect terms with dribbling to avoid steals. Basically follow a real life principle, and never expose the ball too long. In real life once you start your drive you are rarely going to spin multiple times, and rarely would ever cross the ball back in front of you as the defender makes contact with you, so don't do it in Live. I rarely ever get the ball stolen anymore, and I can get into the lane with Kobe/VC/Jameer whenever I want. But like he said, scoring is another story because of the contact and help D.

Also, Johnrice is right too, in this game the mismatch is a devastating advantage/disadvantage. I too have been bringing in Odom and basically, the drive is always available, but then again, simply shooting over Pietrus you can hit at a good % because Pietrus is just too short.

Coupla tips, since I've been studying and dissecting the heck out of this thing:

Seems like some of the sliders are non-functional or broken, for example I reduced the CPU shooting sliders (SHORT RANGE, LONG RANGE, etc) to 0 and the CPU was still hitting 3's on me, as well as med range J's at only a slightly lower %.

The GAME SPEED slider affects players' ability to do that "PUSH THE BALL" animation out on the break. For ex I was trying to slow down the game, so I had it at 8 clicks down, and I noticed that Farmar could no longer do the sprint animation (Kobe could still do it though). I brought it up to only 7 clicks down, and Farmar could then sprint, but Odom still couldn't. At 6 clicks down, Odom was able to do the sprint animation... just something to keep in mind when editing that slider. Seems to affect a player's speed attribute, which isn't a good idea to me. I think the game speed should keep all animations intact, but just slow everything down on a global scale.
In light of this, who knows what sliders affect what, and what animations are opened up/taken away as we edit things.

Guys, I'm able to stay in front of slashers (except Kobe who gets through now and then) pretty much at will, even when being up in their jersey. The key is to GIVE whenever they start a move toward the rim, just give a ft or two, and hit them off at an angle. It works wonders, and the better you get at this, the contact animations will kick in and you will start shutting these dudes down. Me and my bro been shutting each other down as well, vs a human being good at onball D will get you W's trust me. But you gotta give a step or two, and if they step back tap A to get a hand up for the pullup. Like real bball, no one can stop anyone from getting somewhere with the ball, but it's up to the defender to stop them from getting where they WANT to get. Big difference. I love playing D in this game now, and it's a great feeling making people take bad J's or forcing shots because they just can't get around you.

And on offense, we all have a habit (probably from playing 2K or previous bball games) of keeping our sticks pointed at the rim on drives in tandem with the shooting button. In Live this is the worst thing you can do. The layup animations kick in from FAR away (a bit too far IMO) so you want to decide what shot you wanna take as you make your move. But holding LS toward the rim will result in forced shots 9/10 of the time, and frustration. Plus, learning to neutralize LS when needed will open up the great midrange game, and also, it will open you to the practice of using RT and LS together to do the eurosteps and nifty escape moves on drives.

When driving, I've found that you don't even NEED to sizeup or triple threat. By throwing LS to the opposite side of whatever hip your defender is on (with a good slasher), combined with RT, you will always be able to penetrate past your man. For example, with Odom and Pietrus guarding me, I simply jab from a triple threat, drive right, and as soon as Pietrus is on my left hip, hit RT and LS->, and Odom is hopping his way into the lane, or doing some other sweet looking anim leaving Pietrus in the dust. Scoring is another story, if there's traffic. But the key if you want to get a good driving layup or shot in the lane, you have to use the RT and point the LS at a given side of the rim, either the side that less defenders are on, or the opposite side of where your defender is, and you'll often be successful if you have a good penetrator. With Odom vs Pietrus, it's money. Kobe vs anyone, it's money. VC versus Artest or Odom, not always money. Farmar, never money. So know your personnel, but like Johnrice said, gone for good are the days when people get away with leaving scrubs on a good scorer without consequence. Always hated that.

But I've just learned that when you unlearn some old habits, and really employ the control provided, you can really manhandle people. I feel like I've pretty much gotten stuff down at this point, so I CAN'T WAIT to abuse some unlucky newbs Oct.6

EDIT: Superstar level BTW