Madden NFL 13 Video Interview - EA Tiburon Breaks Down Some of the New Changes

[sgibs7]

Quote: Originally Posted by baller7345

I know its not really a big problem if you user control but that was what people were referring too. Well maybe not quite as blunt as that but you get the picture. I wouldn't have attempted what I did there in a normal game I would of just swatted it down. However when you play someone who either doesn't have the skill to make that play or doesn't have the skill to actually user catch that throw then you run into areas where people find things like that annoying. Also while I'd love to play you in a game you picked the worst time. School is ending and with it my access to a high speed internet connection. The only Madden I'll be playing within the next few months will be at a launch tournament come August (unless I get a good connection by then).

good deal man - i want to see if we can get this to be a problem on a very high % clip

[Critical Kills]

Quote: Originally Posted by sgibs7

If its 4th and 35 you should honestly be happy they are going for it - lock up and get the ball back.

Wow..umm..NO, I'm not happy when people play stupidly and unrealistically, even if it benefits me. And that's assuming it's going to benefit me, half the time in NCAA/Madden they actually convert that 4th and 35 which makes things go from being stupid to just outrageously ridiculous.

[ryan36]

Guys, what does 4th and 35 have to do with the topic? And also, I don't want the ball on the opponents 20 all the time. I'd rather sustain a drive.

[Smoke6]

Quote: Originally Posted by baller7345

The problem with some of the sites is how if someone comes out and states they play sim and want tips to play sim they often times get berated or it turns into a debate about why sim isn't realistic to begin with. Now I know this doesn't happen in all sites but I've seen plenty of threads where it happens. Its like that on a whole though, if a sim player heads into a lobby or even creates his own lobby and asks for a sim game he is likely going to get some type of verbal abuse thrown at him or the person he plays is going to lie and use tactics that the sim player doesn't want used. Now I know the reverse is true but its still much harder for a sim player to find tips than it is for a freestyle player. Freestyle players have sites like GGRematch, The Gamer's Lab, etc. While some sites like The Gamer's Lab do try to cater to both facets its much easier for a freestyle player to find informtion on their playstyle. What do sim players have? There is operation but that doesn't have a huge amount tips. Most of the tip sites have more freestyle information than sim information. Now this is something I'd love to see changed, but it seems to be something that very few higher level sim players with to try and do. I've given everything I have this year on Madden School but still if I made a site and put everything I have posted on MS there it wouldn't be a very good site (even if it does include 3 sim style playbook breakdowns).

I keep reading this and I have to answer to why we dont have tip sites catered to the SIM player...

Its because its "always that any given Sunday" atmosphere when you are playing other SIM players! I have lost to many players that were under skilled, they executed their game plan against me and won like they should have. When I thought he was going up top, he hit me with a drag or a hitch for a few yards. As I adapted to this he took advantage of the fact that I started playing more underneath to where he killed up top and won the game.

Its amazing how something so simple that didnt take so much effort or manipulations of the AI could feel so good playing against even when you lose!

There's really no need for tips and tricks for the SIM community, all the tools we need are already at our disposal and the fun part is trying to find those plays and adjustments in stopping our SIM opponent and dont have to worry about some exploit being played out to death in the game. Im not asking for simplicity but too many of these guys know the limitations that these players have on defense if they're in man or zone when in real life you just cant run the same slant against the same guy all game long with the same results and the defense reacting the same exact way.

A fundamentally sound player can defeat the most creative teams or best teams/players in the game.

If you read about most tip sites tips, most is doing nothing but exploiting the AI instead of playing to the opponents weakness along with his teams individual ratings. We dont have to worry about that!

[Smoke6]

Quote: Originally Posted by ryan36

Guys, what does 4th and 35 have to do with the topic? And also, I don't want the ball on the opponents 20 all the time. I'd rather sustain a drive.

Its more about the read and react defense playing out unlike madden 12's where the chances of success on a situation like that are very high.

If read n react is what we think it is, then it really puts the player into a pressure situation and would triple think about going for it or not.

Have you ever played someone where you can feel the emotion of that player just from playing the game online? U can tell they're just not being SIM when a 4th and long arises or a 4th and short and they decide to punt the ball. They're playing it out to put themselves in a better position to try and win the game or comeback.

The other guys dont play with any emotion, that 4th and 35 would fail them while they're down 7 or 14 and they would flat out quit the game. This way we can ensure or hope for longevity while playing and not someone bent on getting as many game splayed in one day as possible!

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by Smoke6

I keep reading this and I have to answer to why we dont have tip sites catered to the SIM player... Its because its "always that any given Sunday" atmosphere when you are playing other SIM players! I have lost to many players that were under skilled, they executed their game plan against me and won like they should have. When I thought he was going up top, he hit me with a drag or a hitch for a few yards. As I adapted to this he took advantage of the fact that I started playing more underneath to where he killed up top and won the game. Its amazing how something so simple that didnt take so much effort or manipulations of the AI could feel so good playing against even when you lose! There's really no need for tips and tricks for the SIM community, all the tools we need are already at our disposal and the fun part is trying to find those plays and adjustments in stopping our SIM opponent and dont have to worry about some exploit being played out to death in the game. Im not asking for simplicity but too many of these guys know the limitations that these players have on defense if they're in man or zone when in real life you just cant run the same slant against the same guy all game long with the same results and the defense reacting the same exact way. A fundamentally sound player can defeat the most creative teams or best teams/players in the game. If you read about most tip sites tips, most is doing nothing but exploiting the AI instead of playing to the opponents weakness along with his teams individual ratings. We dont have to worry about that!

Bravo to this.

This is the point I was making earlier in reference to me not "gameplanning". With Madden being a computer program, the issue with practice is it can quickly become a way to discover how to manipulate the program, instead of actually improving at playing it. It's the equivalent of finding a "safe spot" for beating a Boss character in an arcade game instead of getting better at controlling the in-game player and naturally adjusting to their tactics.

Like I say a lot, Madden is not NFL deep enough for "labbing" to be much more than discovering ways to exploit the program, in general. Of course there probably are exceptions but this general premise seems to hold true, at least the few times I have went into practice mode. Like when I went to check on a goal line fade but ended up be completely disgusted by its' success rate.

The main problem I see with Madden in regard to practicing is that, like Smoke states constantly, certain things can be learned how to trigger so there is a high probability of getting repeated outcomes. That's probably the worst part about "labbing" because people are basically just memorizing the "answer" to preset "problems" they have seen playout over and over. It's not like it should be, for instance perfecting a jumpshot in practice and taking that same shot on gameday is two entirely different things given the variables.

It's difficult to articulate this issue on a message but I really understand what Smoke is trying to say and it's spot on, imo. The question is, how can EA/Tiburon address this issue or randomize player actions on each play, without adding more unrealistic shortcuts?

My repeated answer is to better utilize DPP and other game time variables, like weather, crowd noise, down/distance, nagging injuries, etc, to make things far more unpredictable. Let people "lab" all they want but represent all those x factors for actual games and like real life, Users can prepare as best they can but nothing would be a given or playout remotely the same in any game.